Apr112013
Hearing Transcript on Status of Veterans Employment.
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STATUS OF VETERANS EMPLOYMENT
HEARING BEFORE THE SUBCOMMITTEE ON ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITY OF THE COMMITTEE ON VETERANS' AFFAIRS U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES ONE HUNDRED ELEVENTH CONGRESS SECOND SESSION APRIL 15, 2010 SERIAL No. 111-71 Printed for the use of the Committee on Veterans' Affairs
U.S. GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE For sale by the Superintendent of Documents, U.S. Government Printing Office
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CORRINE BROWN, Florida |
STEVE BUYER, Indiana, Ranking |
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Malcom A. Shorter, Staff Director SUBCOMMITTEE ON ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITY
Pursuant to clause 2(e)(4) of Rule XI of the Rules of the House, public hearing records of the Committee on Veterans' Affairs are also published in electronic form. The printed hearing record remains the official version. Because electronic submissions are used to prepare both printed and electronic versions of the hearing record, the process of converting between various electronic formats may introduce unintentional errors or omissions. Such occurrences are inherent in the current publication process and should diminish as the process is further refined. |
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C O N T E N T S
April 15, 2010
Status of Veterans Employment
OPENING STATEMENTS
Chairwoman Stephanie Herseth Sandlin
Prepared statement of Chairwoman Herseth Sandlin
Hon. Gus Bilirakis
Prepared statement of Congressman Bilirakis
WITNESSES
Congressional Research Service, Library of Congress, Christine A. Scott, Specialist in Social Policy, Income Security Section, Domestic Social Policy Division
Prepared statement of Ms. Scott
U.S. Department of Labor:
Philip L. Rones, Deputy Commissioner, Bureau of Labor Statistics
Prepared statement of Mr. Rones
Hon. Raymond M. Jefferson, Assistant Secretary, Veterans' Employment and Training Service
Prepared statement of Mr. Jefferson
U.S. Office of Personnel Management, Christine M. Griffin, Deputy Director
Prepared statement of Ms. Griffin
U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs, Willie Hensley, Principal Deputy Assistant Secretary, Human Resources and Administration
Prepared statement of Mr. Hensley
American Legion, Mark Walker, Deputy Director, National Economic Commission
Prepared statement of Mr. Walker
Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America, Tim S. Embree, Legislative Associate
Prepared statement of Mr. Embree
National Guard Association of the United States, Colonel Peter J. Duffy, USA (Ret.), Deputy Director of Legislation
Prepared statement of Colonel Duffy
Paralyzed Veterans of America, Richard Daley, Associate Legislation Director
Prepared statement of Mr. Daley
Reserve Officers Association of the United States, Captain Marshall Hanson, USNR (Ret.), Director, Legislative and Military Policy, and also on behalf of Reserve Enlisted Association
Prepared statement of Captain Hanson
Veterans of Foreign Wars of the United States, Justin Brown, Legislative Associate, National Legislative Service
Prepared statement of Mr. Brown
MATERIAL SUBMITTED FOR THE RECORD
Post-Hearing Follow-up Material:
Post-Hearing Questions and Responses for the Record:
STATUS OF VETERANS EMPLOYMENT
Thursday, April 15, 2010
U. S. House of Representatives,
Subcommittee on Economic Opportunity,
Committee on Veterans' Affairs,
Washington, DC.
The Subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 2:13 p.m., in Room 334, Cannon House Office Building, Hon. Stephanie Herseth Sandlin [Chairwoman of the Subcommittee] presiding.
Present: Representatives Herseth Sandlin, Perriello, Adler, Teague, and Bilirakis.
OPENING STATEMENT OF CHAIRWOMAN HERSETH SANDLIN
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. The Committee on Veterans’ Affairs Subcommittee on Economic Opportunity hearing on the Status of Veterans Employment will come to order. I ask unanimous consent that all Members have 5 legislative days to revise and extend their remarks and that written statements be made part of the record. Hearing no objections, so ordered.
Today’s hearing will provide us an opportunity to review existing programs to help homeless veterans become employed; review barriers to employment; discuss hiring authorities; and learn about possible causes of high unemployment rates among younger veterans and female veterans. Furthermore, we will hear from an array of distinguished panelists, who will highlight the shortfalls of Federal programs while providing recommendations for us to consider regarding veteran employment opportunities. While the high unemployment rates among veterans is disturbing, we will also receive timely updates from Administration officials highlighting their initiatives to address the concerns of our veterans population.
I would like to commend President Obama for implementing Executive Order 13518 to strengthen veteran employment opportunities within the Federal workforce. I would also like to commend the various agencies who have initiated new veterans programs that require no Congressional intervention. These include the Office of Personnel Management’s (OPM) new Feds Hire Vets Web site, and the Department of Labor’s (DOL's) initiative to expand Job Corps participation to military veterans.
I look forward to hearing from all of our witnesses here today. I now recognize our Ranking Member, Mr. Bilirakis, for any opening remarks he may have.
[The prepared statement of Chairwoman Herseth Sandlin appears in the Appendix.]
OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. GUS BILIRAKIS
Mr. BILIRAKIS. Thank you, Madam Chair. I appreciate it very much. Madam Chair, our oversight agenda has covered many subjects during the 111th Congress. But this may be the most important. It is no secret that the recession has hit America hard, and that unemployment rates have stood at record, or near record numbers, including the rates for veterans. The March 2010 data from the Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS) shows that about 50,000, or about 25 percent, of 18- to 24-year old veterans were unemployed. At the same time about 955,000, or about 9.5 percent of veterans between the ages of 25 and 64 were unemployed.
While any unemployed veterans is worthy of our assistance, I see significant differences in these two age groups in terms of financial resources and financial obligations. For example, while our younger veterans are likely eligible for either the Montgomery or the Post-9/11 GI Bill and have fewer financial obligations, most of the older group has likely passed their delimiting dates for the GI Bill, or only have access to the less generous Montgomery GI Bill, or have used up their entitlement. Older veterans are also more likely to have financial obligations, such as mortgages and tuition payments. So these differences raise the policy question of where to focus whatever scarce resources we have.
Regardless of where we choose to place these resources, they must be efficiently and effectively applied. During this recession, Congress has extended unemployment benefits at least twice. And while softening the blow of losing one’s job is important, I believe that we should view this as an opportunity to reshape the workforce by retaining the unemployed in skills that will be in demand as the economy recovers. And that should begin with our veterans, of course.
It makes no sense to pay people to remain qualified only for jobs that may never reappear in the economy. For example, it is no secret that the manufacturing sector, such as the auto industry, has contracted over the past couple decades. Assembly jobs have moved out of the traditional manufacturing States to States with lower labor costs, or moved overseas. That means that if workers want to remain in the industry where their skills are needed they must be willing to relocate. Madam Chair, that was the whole idea behind H.R. 1168, actually which the Ranking Member introduced, Mr. Boozman, and it passed under your leadership.
So how do we fix the issue? Because without a massive reversal of the outflow of jobs, those who have worked in downsized industries must gain new and relevant skills to once again be fully and adequately employed. Madam Chair, according to the Conference Board, an organization which tracks a variety of business-related data, national employment peaked in the summer of 2008 at about 138 million, and online help wanted ads totaled 4.9 million. In February of 2010, national unemployment totals about 130 million with help wanted ads running at about 4 million. Clearly there are jobs out there and our challenge is to provide veterans with the skills to fill them.
Here are the Board’s top ten in demand occupations. Number one, health care practitioners and technical; computer and mathematical science; management; sales and related; office administrative support; business and financial operations; architectural and engineering; health care support; transportation and material moving; and the last one arts, design, entertainment, sports, and media.
We have all read the gross statistics and what we now need to know more about are the whys, as in why are younger veterans experiencing such high rates? To that end, I look forward to hearing solutions from our witnesses on how to invest in our workforce. Thank you, and I yield back Madam Chair.
[The prepared statement of Congressman Bilirakis appears in the Appendix.]
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Thank you, Mr. Bilirakis. And I want to thank the other Members of our Subcommittee for joining us at the hearing. We welcome all of our panels testifying before the Subcommittee today, and I would like to remind each of our witnesses that your complete written statements have been made part of the hearing record. I would ask that you limit your remarks to 5 minutes so we have sufficient time for followup with questions once everyone has had the opportunity to provide their testimony. We have a number of witnesses here today.
Joining us on our first panel is Ms. Christine Scott. She is a Specialist in Social Policy for the Congressional Research Service, and Mr. Phil Rones, Deputy Commissioner, Bureau of Labor Statistics, U.S. Department of Labor. We welcome you both to the Subcommittee. We look forward to your testimony highlighting the important research that you have done. I will recognize Ms. Scott first. You are recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENTS OF CHRISTINE A. SCOTT, SPECIALIST IN SOCIAL POLICY, INCOME SECURITY SECTION, DOMESTIC SOCIAL POLICY DIVISION, CONGRESSIONAL RESEARCH SERVICE, LIBRARY OF CONGRESS; AND PHILIP L. RONES, DEPUTY COMMISSIONER, BUREAU OF LABOR STATISTICS, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF LABOR
STATEMENT OF CHRISTINE A. SCOTT
Ms. SCOTT. Thank you. Chairwoman Herseth Sandlin, Ranking Member Bilirakis, and Members of the Subcommittee, my name is Christine Scott from the Congressional Research Service and I am honored to appear before this Subcommittee today.
As requested by the Committee, my testimony will focus on three topics. The current situation for employment of veterans, barriers to employment, and employment assistance to veterans.
First, the employment situation of veterans. My written testimony has a figure in several tables related to this and because of time limitations I will be going through them and only getting a few of the key points related to each table. Okay? The additional details about the data and the tables are contained in the written testimony.
First, figure one shows the monthly unemployment rates showing a 3-month moving average from January 2006, before the current economic downturn, through December 2009. As you can see in the figure, the unemployment rate for Gulf War Veterans, Gulf War II Veterans, is higher than for non-veterans. And the unemployment rate overall for veterans of other periods of service, labeled here as other veterans, is lower than that of non-veterans.
However, this comparison of the overall unemployment rates does not show the entire story, what is going on behind the unemployment rates. As you can see in table one, the highest unemployment rates across all three groups are for those individuals ages 18 to 24 and 25 to 34. In addition, as shown in table two, the largest changes in unemployment rates between 2006 and 2009 are for individuals ages 18 to 24, both males and females. This is important because 63 percent of the Gulf War II veterans population is under age 35. This is driving their unemployment rates.
Between 2006 and 2009, the unemployment rate for male Gulf War II veterans increased from 6.4 percent 9.9 percent. While the unemployment rates for male veterans of other periods of service, and male non-veterans more than doubled. For male veterans of other periods of service the unemployment rate increased from 3.4 to 7.9 percent, and for male non-veterans it increased from 4.4 to 10.3 percent. The unemployment rate for female Gulf War II veterans increased from 7 to 11.5 percent, while the unemployment rates for female veterans of other periods of service increased from 4.9 to 7.0 percent, and for female non-veterans from 4.3 to 7.8 percent.
Table three shows the unemployment rate by periods of service, for disabled veterans, those with a service-connected disability, and non-disabled veterans. While the rates for disabled and non-disabled veterans are very close, the rates are higher however for Gulf War I and Gulf War II veterans with a service-connected disability.
Table four relates to what is considered the long-term unemployed, that is unemployed 27 weeks or longer. Gulf War II veterans have a slightly lower percentage that would be considered long-term unemployed, while veterans of other periods of service have a slightly higher rate of long-term unemployment than non-veterans.
Table five shows the percentage for full-time and part-time for these three groups. Overall, veterans have a higher percentage full-time employed than non-veterans. However, there are variances for the youngest veterans, 18 to 24, and for the older veterans, 65 and older, where the percentage of people with part-time employment are significantly higher, even for non-veterans.
Sorry, and I need to go back. Excuse me.
Table six shows the percentage for each group of public and private industry and self-employment. Overall, Gulf War II veterans and veterans of other periods of service have higher percentages employed in the public sector compared to non-veterans. In addition, Gulf War II veterans have a lower percentage of self-employed compared to non-veterans. Other veterans have a higher percentage of self-employed because of their older age. Self-employment tends to increase with age. As a result, the overall self-employment rate for veterans of other periods of service is higher than for non-veterans.
Table seven shows for the Federal Government, the total Federal workforce that is percentage veterans, and the top ten executive agencies with the percentages of their workforces that are veterans. Between 2005 and 2008, the overall percentage for the Federal Government only increased slightly from 25.2 to 25.5 percent of the workforce. And the top seven did not change between 2005 and 2008 in terms of agencies.
Federal agencies have three special hiring authorities available to them. The Veterans Recruitment Appointment, the Veterans Employment Opportunity Act, and 30 Percent or More Disabled Veterans. In fiscal year 2008, depending on the type of appointment authority, 90 to 95 percent of the special hire appointments were by the U.S. Department of Defense (DoD), the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs (VA), or the Armed Forces branches.
Next let me turn to barriers to employment. Veterans, like non-veterans, may face one or more barriers to employment, and there are a number of different barriers to employment. Four major barriers are first education and training. A veteran without the education or training for a specific industry will have difficulty finding employment in the industry. This is true for recently separated servicemembers whose military skills may not translate directly to the civilian industry, and for older veterans and non-veterans who have worked many years but are in an industry that is currently in decline.
Second, disability. Disability has many forms. Chronic conditions, physical impairments, mental impairments, and addiction issues. Certainly disabilities, such as ost-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD) and traumatic brain injury (TBI) are more prevalent in veterans than in non-veterans. Veterans with one or more disabilities will face difficulties in finding employment and in dealing with these difficulties in the workplace, with these disabilities.
Third, lack of a mentor and employment network. While veterans were serving in the military their non-veterans peers were finding and establishing mentors and employment networks within their chosen occupation.
Fourth, homelessness. Living without a fixed address creates a number of challenges in finding and maintaining employment and research has shown that veterans are overrepresented in the homeless population.
Last, assistance with employment. The Federal Government has several programs to assist veterans with employment. Among them are the transition programs coordinated by the Departments of Defense, Labor and Veterans Affairs; Department of Labor grants to State governments for State employments to assist veterans in finding employment and promoting hiring of veterans. The Department of Labor also makes grants to organizations to assist homeless veterans in meeting their needs to transition back into the workforce. And finally, but not least, the Department of Veterans Affairs has programs for veterans with disabilities, including the Compensated Work Therapy Program and the Vocational Rehabilitation and Employment (VR&E) Program.
The Department of Labor also operates the America’s Heroes at Work Web site, which provides among other things, fact sheets and other information for employers and veterans related to PTSD and TBI in the workplace. There is also the Feds Hire Vets service, which contains among other things a listing by agency of the individual within that agency who is responsible for promoting the hiring of veterans, including their phone number and email address.
That concludes my testimony. And I will be happy to answer any questions that Members may have.
[The prepared statement of Ms. Scott appears in the Appendix.]
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Thank you, Ms. Scott. We appreciate the helpful statistics and your testimony. Mr. Rones? Am I pronouncing that correctly?
Mr. RONES. That is correct.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Very good. You are now recognized for 5 minutes.
Mr. RONES. Thank you Madam Chair and Members of the Subcommittee. I thank you for the opportunity to discuss the employment situation of veterans.
I would like to start by stressing the way that the Bureau of Labor Statistics views these data that might be a little different than some others. And what I would caution is that people be careful in overanalyzing some data that are thin. And let me give you an example. We have heard about the unemployment rates of young veterans, and young male veterans. And in fact, the most recent figure we put out for March, the unemployment rate was 32 percent. And obviously that is a very, very high number. But I looked at the whole series of unemployment rates for that group. And if I go back a year ago, in successive months, the rates were 14 percent and 34 percent. Now how does that happen? Out of the roughly 100,000 people that we interview for this survey each month, only about 80 are these young veterans. I mean, that is their share of the population. And maybe 15 of them are unemployed. So we are extrapolating to a whole population of young veterans based on the 15 who happen to be unemployed in this month, and maybe 25 next month, or 10 next month. So I would stress that we be very careful with taking a single month’s data. That is why we prefer looking at annual average data, combining 12 months, getting a lot more information when we are looking at these data.
Let me go through a couple of the highlights. I have submitted both a formal testimony and some slides that back that testimony up. The one thing that you have to be careful in comparing the veterans with other groups is that you are comparing apples and oranges. Demographics are really important. For example, many recent veterans are fairly young, and younger people, whether veterans or non-veterans, tend to have very high unemployment rates. The most salient point I could make about all our employment statistics is every group has been very severely hurt by this recession, certainly veterans included.
We collect data both every month on veteran status and then some very detailed information once a year, and I should point out we have actually added a table to our monthly employment situation report on the status of veterans and non-veterans quite recently.
In 2009, there were about 22 million veterans in the population. About half last served in World War II-era, Korea, or Vietnam periods. So virtually all of them are age 55 and over and only 3 percent are women. And it is important that when we look at the labor force status on veterans in general they take into account that there is a very large portion of them who are certainly in retirement ages at this point.
About 2 million veterans served during the period designated Gulf War Era II, accounting for nearly one in ten of all veterans. These veterans are young, nearly two-thirds are under the age of 35, and far more of them are women than in earlier eras. Eighteen percent are women.
For most age and sex groups employment status does not vary very much based on veteran status. Male veterans aged 18 to 24, though, are somewhat more likely to have jobs than their non-veterans counterparts. And I stress that because very often people look at the unemployment rates, but the goal in general is employment. So I ask people to look at the flip side as well. What proportion of the population actually has jobs?
Veterans of Gulf War Ear II who served in combat or war zones had employment rates that were similar to those of veterans who did not serve in combat or war zones. And there was no statistically significant difference between the unemployment rate for female and male veterans overall. The rates were actually 8.0 and 8.1 percent respectively last year. The jobless rates for female and male veterans of just the Gulf War II were not statistically different either.
In August, 2009 about 2.8 million veterans, or 13 percent of the total, reported have a service-connected disability. The one thing that I would say about the disability statistics is again look at employment rather than unemployment. And even if the unemployment rates look similar, what you see for disabled veterans, as you would with the disabled population in general, is that the more severe the disability rating the lower the employment rate. And that to me is the most important statistic.
And I will leave it at that. And certainly I would be glad to answer any questions.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Rones appears in the Appendix.]
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Thank you, Mr. Rones, for your testimony as well, and the charts and statistics that you provided with your written testimony. If I could start, Ms. Scott are there key characteristics that could account for the difference in employment between female Gulf War II veterans and female non-veterans?
Ms. SCOTT. The primary difference is going to be age, okay, in driving a lot of these unemployment rates. For non-veterans the population is somewhat evenly distributed across the age groups, and between men and women it is very similar. There are only a few points difference one way or another until you get to the 65 and older where there are fewer males. Gulf War II veterans, females like males, are very young. Okay? When you get to veterans of other periods of service about 70 percent of the veterans of other periods of service who are male are 55 or over, where about 51 percent of the female veterans of other periods of service are between ages of 35 and 54. Okay? So the female veterans of other periods of military service are younger than the males. And that is part of what is driving their female unemployment rates there.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Then specifically on table seven you list the executive agencies that have the highest percentage of veterans in their workforce, by the 2 different years. I will not pose this question to you, but it is interesting that Department of Justice and Department of Labor go slightly down the ranks from 1 year to the next, in terms of the chart that you provide. In the research that you have done, do you have any reasons why these specific agencies have a higher percentage than others? I mean, clearly if it is armed forces, Department of Defense, Department of Veterans Affairs, Homeland Security, there could be relationship as it relates to interest and skills that match the agency needs. Do you have other reasons when you look across all agencies? Are some doing a better job than others in specifically recruiting veterans?
Ms. SCOTT. I do not have the research to support any definitive conclusions as to why it is in one agency more than the other. I would keep in mind that the Departments of Defense and Veterans Affairs are among two of the largest in the Federal Government.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. I do not know which table off the top of my head here, but when we looked at public versus private sector employment, do veterans with a disability tend to work more in the private or the public sector? Do you have that information?
Ms. SCOTT. Not readily available, but I will get back to the Committee.
[Ms. Scott subsequently provided the following information:]
Employer Percentage of Employed Veterans
(with a Service-Connected Disability)Private 31.3%
Public 62.3%
Self-Employed 6.4%
Total 100.0%
Source: Congressional Research Service analysis of August 2009 Veterans Supplement to the Current Population Survey (CPS).
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Mr. Rones, have you been able to measure as it relates, I understand the caution that you are giving us as we look at annual trends and averages versus 1 month, and the age of some of the veterans groups we are looking at. Are Gulf War II Era veterans unemployed and seeking employment? Or are they enrolled in school? I mean, are you able to break down these numbers to give sort of reasons for the percentages and then who is seeking employment versus who may be enrolled in courses?
Mr. RONES. Yes, I did notice that the school enrollment rates for veterans aged 25 to 34 seemed to be a bit lower than for non-veterans. Or actually, it is not the school enrollment. It's educational attainment, which are closely related. What seems to happen, though, is the veterans catch up to the non-veterans by the time they are in the 30's or so, and that makes sense.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Right.
Mr. RONES. That is, veterans are going to school later.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Right.
Mr. RONES. But we do have data on both enrollment status and educational attainment, and of course age.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. I may have one or two follow-up questions, but I would like to recognize the Ranking Member for questions he may have?
Mr. BILIRAKIS. Thank you, Madam Chair. I appreciate it. For the panel, I understand your point about the unemployment has hit a record high and is very hard. But why are young veterans experiencing an unemployment rate double their non-veteran peers? And I understand the sample is low on a monthly basis. But if you could answer that question I would appreciate it.
Mr. RONES. I think they are not, and that was the point I was trying to make earlier. If I look at the annual average unemployment rates, which would be more reliable because there is just more information going into them. So for 2009, if you look at 18- to 24-year-old veterans, the rate was 21.1 percent and it was 16.6 percent for non-veterans. Because, of course, the veterans and non-veterans have a different gender mix, if I just look at young men it is 21.6 percent for the veterans and 19.1 percent for the non-veterans. So they are both high. The veterans are slightly higher. But I think some of the press reports have gotten that wrong, again, because they focused on some of that monthly data, which really show some outliers.
Mr. BILIRAKIS. Ma’am, could you give me your opinion as well on that?
Ms. SCOTT. Mr. Rones is correct. The unemployment rates for Gulf War II veterans overall and for men are only slightly higher than for comparable non-veterans. For females it is a little higher, 19.2 versus 13.9 percent. But there is a small number issue related to female Gulf War II veterans in terms of overall numbers compared to female non-veterans. So in general, the rates are higher because they are younger.
Mr. BILIRAKIS. Thank you. I appreciate that. With regard to unemployment benefits, does anyone leaving military service automatically qualify for unemployment benefits in all 50 States? Whoever would like to take that?
Mr. RONES. I am sorry, I do not know the answer to that.
Mr. BILIRAKIS. Okay, could you please get back to us on that? We would appreciate that, thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair. I yield back.
[Mr. Rones subsequently provided the information in a follow-up letter, dated May 3, 2010, which appears in the Appendix.]
[In addition, Ms. Scott subsequently provided the following information:]
Unemployment Compensation for Ex-Servicemembers (UCX) provides unemployment benefits while former active duty military personnel or reservists released from active-duty search for work. The Emergency Unemployment Compensation Act of 1991 (P.L. 102-164) provided that ex-servicemembers be treated the same as other unemployed workers with respect to benefit levels, the waiting period for benefits, and benefit duration. The attached Congressional Research Service report RS22440, Unemployment Compensation (Insurance) and Military Service, by Julie M. Whittaker discusses servicemembers’ eligibility for unemployment compensation in more detail. [The CRS Report appears in the Appendix.]
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Thank you, Mr. Bilirakis. And that is a very important question. And so in addition to our witnesses on this panel taking that question perhaps we might want to pose that question to some of the other witnesses, too, to see if anyone joining us here today has that information.
I will just, let us see, let me just pose one more question for you, Mr. Rones. Why are retired veterans counted as unemployed?
Mr. RONES. They are not, necessarily.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Is there a separate category?
Mr. RONES. There are two concepts that we are getting mixed up. One is unemployment and the other is non-employment, and I will tell you the difference. In our labor force survey, people are characterized in one of three categories. You are either working, which means we count you as employed, or you are actively looking for work and available to work if a job was offered to you; then you are unemployed. Or you are out of the labor force. So the retired people who are not looking for work are not counted as unemployed, they are just out of the labor force and they are not part of that unemployment calculation because they are not looking for work.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Are we capturing everyone, then?
Mr. RONES. Sure. Everyone is in one of those three categories. You are either—
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Even, okay.
Mr. RONES. And so in our labor force survey, there is no upper age limit. We classified people, you know, all the way up through 99, and the lower age limit is 16.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. What about someone who enlisted at 18—
Mr. RONES. Right.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN [continued]. Retired after 20, and is using an education benefit—
Mr. RONES. Well, if—
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN [continuing]. After they separate from service. How are they—
Mr. RONES. Okay, if they are going to school full-time, and not looking for work, then they are out of the labor force. They are just like any student would be. Once they start looking for work, and they might actually do that as a student as well. But once they are looking for work, and would be available to take a job, they would be counted as unemployed if they are not able to find work.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Okay. So you do not think we need another category for the specifically retired?
Mr. RONES. Well, we have that. Among the people who are not in the labor force—
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. But you—
Mr. RONES [continuing]. We break that out by reason.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Oh, you do? Okay. All right.
Mr. RONES. So whether you are retired, or whether it is largely disabled, household reasons.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Okay. All right. Any other questions for this panel? Okay. Well, I thank you both again for your testimony highlighting very important research, making important points as it relates to our interpretation of the data that is out there in furtherance of the work that we are looking at. Mr. Teague, I do not know, did you step out and step back in? I apologize. Let me recognize Mr. Teague for any comments or questions he has of the panel.
Mr. TEAGUE. I did want to ask, I see, you know, we have been talking about primarily the males. What about the females? Have we, what have we been doing to check on them, to separate them out?
Mr. RONES. Well, as I think Ms. Scott mentioned a moment ago, the unemployment rates for young veteran females seem to be a bit higher than those for non-veterans. But there is a double caution. You know, the problem that I said about the young men, well only 18 percent of these young veterans are women. So we are looking at smaller and smaller cells. Literally every month we might have no more than a handful of female unemployed veterans in the sample, and this is the largest sample survey there is. You know, we are surveying 100,000 people a month. But these are very, very small groups.
Mr. TEAGUE. Well, and I understand that. But, you know, you are talking about 100,000 a month. And, you know, for the national unemployment they do 460,000 a week. And, I mean, they have them fill out paperwork and everything, too. So can we get that information and get a broader spectrum so that we can take care of them?
Mr. RONES. I do not know whether the, you are talking about the unemployment insurance system, which is really unrelated to the labor force survey that I have been discussing. I do not know whether on intake to the unemployment insurance system they have that information on veteran status.
Mr. TEAGUE. It will just be one more question. And if it is a different set of information we should still be able to get privilege to it.
Mr. RONES. I am sure, I am sure the Employment and Training Administration that administers that program would be happy to let the staff know what information they have about unemployment insurance claims. I have never seen anything out of that program on veteran status, but Bureau of Labor Statistics is not involved. So I could be wrong about that.
Mr. TEAGUE. Okay, thank you.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Just remind me again, the double caution there, what was the annual average for female Gulf War II veterans? How did that compare to female non-veterans?
Ms. SCOTT. For 2009, the annual average for female Gulf War II veterans was 11.5 compared to 7.8 for female non-veterans. For 18 to 24 it was 19.2 percent for female Gulf War II veterans, and 13.9 percent for female non-veterans. But there is a difference in the population, as noted by Mr. Rones. Only 18 percent of the Gulf War II veterans are female, where almost 50 percent of the non-veterans are female.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Except it is a similar gap. Right? I mean, you just gave me the annual average for all female veterans
Ms. SCOTT. Right.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Female veterans versus female non-veterans. But then when you break it down to the 18 to 24, you are looking at a four point gap.
Ms. SCOTT. Six point gap.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. A five or six point gap. I mean, so there is something that we need there is something going on in terms of overall and this specific age group where I do not think you have the same in terms of, well it is, it is about a five point gap in terms of overall the 18 to 24, not breaking them down male to female. I think this has been very helpful, and we appreciate the caution. I think there is in the other panels that we will be hearing from some justification of causes for the gap that exists. You know, some that we can speculate on, some that we have seen in some of the testimony. But again, informing sort of gaps in certain programs to reach and do more effective outreach to try to find employment for our female veterans, regardless of age group.
I appreciate again your testimony, and we appreciate your being here today. Mr. Teague has another followup for the panel?
Mr. TEAGUE. Yes, thank you. I’m sorry. First, I am sorry, I want to thank you for holding this hearing because I think it is very important. I want to thank you for testifying. I appreciate that. But I do want to point a couple of things that I just want to be sure that everybody takes a look at it from my perspective one time.
Even though we are talking about 7.8 to 11.5, you know, that is two to one. As is the 19 to 13. That is, you know, 50 percent more in our veterans. And I do not know if that, you know, a while ago you said there was a bit of difference. I did not think that 50 percent was a bit. I thought it was pretty substantial, even if we are talking about a small group. Thank you.
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Again, thank you for your testimony, and your service in each of your agencies that informs not only our Committee’s work but so many across the different Committees here in the U.S. House of Representatives. Thank you for being with us today.
I would now like to ask the second panel to join us at the witness table. Joining us is Mr. Mark Walker, Deputy Director of the Economics Commission for the American Legion; Mr. Tim Embree, Legislative Associate for the Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America (IAVA); Mr. Richard Daley, Associate Legislative Director of the Paralyzed Veterans of America (PVA); Mr. Justin Brown, Legislative Associate, National Legislative Service for the Veterans of Foreign Wars of the United States (VFW); Mr. Marshall Hanson, Director of Legislative and Military Policy, Reserve Officers Association of the United States (ROA); and Colonel Peter Duffy, Deputy Director of Legislation, the National Guard Association of the United States (NGAUS).
Welcome to all of you gentlemen. We appreciate having you back to the Subcommittee. We look forward to your testimony on this very important topic today. Mr. Walker, we will start with you. Again, all of your written statements have been entered into the hearing record so you will each be recognized for 5 minutes.
STATEMENTS OF MARK WALKER, DEPUTY DIRECTOR, NATIONAL ECONOMIC COMMISSION, AMERICAN LEGION; TIM S. EMBREE, LEGISLATIVE ASSOCIATE, IRAQ AND AFGHANISTAN VETERANS OF AMERICA; RICHARD DALEY, ASSOCIATE LEGISLATION DIRECTOR, PARALYZED VETERANS OF AMERICA; JUSTIN BROWN, LEGISLATIVE ASSOCIATE, NATIONAL LEGISLATIVE SERVICE, VETERANS OF FOREIGN WARS OF THE UNITED STATES; CAPTAIN MARSHALL HANSON, USNR (RET.), DIRECTOR, LEGISLATIVE AND MILITARY POLICY, RESERVE OFFICERS ASSOCIATION OF THE UNITED STATES, ALSO ON BEHALF OF RESERVE ENLISTED ASSOCIATION; AND COLONEL PETER J. DUFFY, USA (RET.), DEPUTY DIRECTOR OF LEGISLATION, NATIONAL GUARD ASSOCIATION OF THE UNITED STATES
Mr. WALKER. Madam Chairwoman, Ranking Member, and distinguished Members of the Subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity to submit the views of the American Legion regarding the status of veterans employment.
With the high veterans unemployment rate, particularly among younger veterans, there is an immense need to ensure that veterans are getting trained and are afforded ample opportunities to succeed in this unstable job market. The American Legion is eager to see the Department of Labor Veterans' Employment and Training Service (VETS) expand its outreach efforts with creative initiatives designed to improve employment and training service for veterans and increase training opportunities, support, and options for veterans who seek entrepreneurial careers. The American Legion seeks legislation that will transfer all disabled veteran outreach program specialists and local veteran employment representatives from the State agencies to VETS program for supervision and oversight in order to ensure that the individuals employed to serve veterans are not used for other programs.
Also, the American Legion supports new legislation, H.R. 929, that would authorize $60 million for the next 10 years to fund a program modeled after the highly successful Servicemembers Occupational Conversion and Training Act, SMOCTA for short. SMOCTA was a unique job training program because there was a job for the veteran among completion of training. Many local veterans employment representatives and disabled veteran outreach program specialists publicly praised the effectiveness of SMOCTA because it successfully returned veterans to the civilian workforce. In addition, many veterans prefer traditional employment and/or require employment for personal or family reasons.
The American Legion recommends that flight training, correspondence schools, vocational schools programs and on the job training programs be included in the Post-9/11 GI bill. This would allow veterans who are seeking traditional employment the opportunity to get into the civilian workforce sooner. The American Legion believes that veterans should never be limited in the manner they use their educational benefits. Furthermore, the American Legion supports efforts that require DoD to take appropriate steps to ensure that servicemembers may be trained, tested, evaluated, and issued any license or certification that may be required in the civilian workforce prior to separation. The American Legion believes that Federal employment programs that are adequately funded, staffed and supervised, along with the clear message to the private sector that employing veterans is good for business, will make a significant difference in veterans obtaining gainful employment. America’s veterans deserve no less than ample opportunities for success in the civilian workforce.
Again, thank you for the opportunity to submit the opinion of the American Legion on this important issue.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Walker appears in the Appendix.]
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Thank you, Mr. Walker. Mr. Embree, welcome back to the Subcommittee. You are now recognized.
Mr. EMBREE. Thank you, ma’am. Madam Chairwoman, Ranking Member, and Members of the Subcommittee. On behalf of Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America’s 180,000 members and supporters, I would like to thank you for inviting us to testify before your Subcommittee today.
My name is Tim Embree and I served two tours in Iraq with the United States Marine Corps Reserve. The status of veterans employment is a critical issue facing many Iraq and Afghanistan veterans as they come home. IAVA welcomes the opportunity to discuss this issue with you.
IAVA recommends a comprehensive veterans employment bill, consisting of job placement, job protection, and job training. Our full recommendations are enumerated in my written testimony which has been submitted to this Committee. The experience of previous generations of veterans suggests that today’s veterans may continue to struggle for years to come if we do not act now. Unemployment rates among new veterans are staggering and continue to rise dramatically. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, in 2009, the average unemployment rate for Iraq and Afghanistan-era veterans was 10.2 percent. As of March 2010, that number is up to 14.7 percent. IAVA member named Will is one of the unemployed making up this 14.7 percent. Will also served in the Marine Corps. He was an aviation electronics technician with a top secret security clearance. You would think this would make him a potentially attractive hire in the tech economy. But he has been unemployed since he left the service nearly 4 months ago. Will has applied with the VA, the California Employment Development Department, and several aerospace companies. He has applied at companies like Best Buy, Dish Network, and Direct TV. With no end to his unemployment in sight, Will has begun applying for minimum wage jobs despite years of dedicated service, leadership experience, and impressive and specialized skills in the tech industry. Will’s search has been an emotionally and financially draining process. He is very close to losing his home. Unfortunately, it is a story playing out in households across the country.
Look around this room. If everyone in this room were a veteran more than one in ten of you would be searching for employment just like Will. Our servicemen and women are doing everything they were told would make them a valuable asset to civilian employers. We are failing them because we are not doing enough. Servicemembers are leaving the military and finding a civilian marketplace that does not understand them or their skills, and treats them with indifference. We can and must do better.
For veterans like Will IAVA recommends job training, job placement, and job protection. Some of these necessary fixes include education. It is the best way to ready our veterans for high quality, high earning jobs. And the new GI Bill is the greatest investment in veterans and their families since World War II. It could not have come at a better time. Unfortunately, a significant number of veterans are still excluded from the new GI Bill. Apprenticeships, on the job training, and vocational programs are excluded from the new GI Bill but are so vital to veterans' job training. IAVA believes the Post-9/11 GI Bill should be extended to veterans enrolled in these highly beneficial programs.
Improve job placement programs by increasing the Department of Labor VETS budget by $7.3 million for fiscal year 2011. IAVA is pleased to see the President’s budget for fiscal year 2011 is asking for a 14 percent increase in funding for the Transition Assistance Program, commonly known as TAP. And these funds must be used to modernize TAP, and the program must be mandatory for all servicemembers to ensure every separating veteran receives the job training they need to secure meaningful employment.
Improving TAP is just one part of the equation. We find that employers often cannot translate between military certifications, training and experience to their civilian equivalents. This is what is holding Will back. If employers had a real sense of what he brings to the table, they would be climbing over themselves to hire him. Another example are the military medics, who have performed difficult medical procedures under unimaginable conditions, who barely qualify to drive an ambulance once they transfer back to the civilian world. IAVA requests a Congressional study on the differences between DoD and civilian certifications and licenses.
And we must continue to incentivize hiring Iraq and Afghanistan veterans beyond 2010 and by extending the tax credits for hiring vets in the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act. We must protect Guardsmen and Reservist jobs by fully restoring funding to the Employee Support of the Guard and Reserve (ESGR) program. It is slated to be cut by 17 percent in fiscal year 2011.
Your hard work has led to successful veterans jobs programs, such as Vetsuccess.gov, and Warrior Gateway, and Helmets to Hardhats. We are pleased the VA is reaching out to potential employers and recruiting them to participate on Vetsuccess.gov. However, this site should be combined with the OPM’s Veterans Job Site. We need to coordinate efforts.
Our servicemen and women have so much more to offer than just punctuality and respectful attitude. Our veterans are one of our Nation’s greatest assets. We must treat them as such. I appreciate this opportunity to speak to you today and welcome any questions you may have. Thank you very much for your time.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Embree appears in the Appendix.]
Ms. HERSETH SANDLIN. Thank you very much for your testimony. Mr. Daley, you are now recognized for 5 minutes.
Mr. DALEY. Madam Chair, Ranking Member Bilirakis, I would like to thank you on behalf of the Paralyzed Veterans of America, a veterans service organization comprised of 20,000 men and women who have honorably served in the military and have suffered a
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